Message Board - Pests, Weeds and Diseases: worms-microscolex phosphoreus
25 Jan 2008 by britboy
got massive worm problem on bowling green ,identified as microscolex phosphoreus on the www.theturfdiseasecentre.co.uk thousands of small casts and usual worm products not working. help,has anyone else got these and what are u doing about it?
britboy
25 Jan 2008 by jlawrence
see this thread - http://www.pitchcare.com/message/message/14026
I don't know if Gary is correct about there being no control. My guess is that you may be best speaking to a 'worm' expert.
Of course there's no bounce, bend your back and put some bloody effort in.
25 Jan 2008 by jlawrence
There were two talks on 'worms' at Harrogate.
One was on killing them - which I think was given by a guy from Sherriff (01638 721888) - and the other was from ORM (01227 860 901) on using them to your benefit. Both people certainly knew more info about worms than I knew existed so it might be worth giving them a ring.
Can someone let me know who it was from Sherriff that did the first talk - at the moment I can't find the few notes I took.
Of course there's no bounce, bend your back and put some bloody effort in.
25 Jan 2008 by vid
Jon - Graham Paul from Sherriff wrote the article in pitchcare (Article 3957) I would imagine it was him.
On the post - surely we dont need to go into this again aaaaaaaagggggggggggghhhhhh!!!
25 Jan 2008 by jlawrence
Thanks vid. Yes it was Graham Paul and a very interesting talk it was.
Of course there's no bounce, bend your back and put some bloody effort in.
25 Jan 2008 by britboy
sorry this seems to bore you vid,i know theres been loads of chat on worms,carbendazim etc- and i know that chemical works on your run of the mill worms but i can assure you this new breed of worm is immune.When i say thousands of casts i mean it-makes cutting green impossible due to mud build up on mower and smearing.Have a look at the turf disease centre article before you comment-believe me if you had this problem on fine turf you would be panicking!
britboy
25 Jan 2008 by dave r-b
not being funny ebony but if your green as worm casts on it why arent you caining it first before mowing?
vid, give the guy a chance.
as for worms i know there as been a lot of talk of late about them but if ebony is having trouble eliminating them then why shoot him down for asking.
ebony do as JL suggests and give the guy above a call.
im now an ex groundsman but hey old habits die hard
25 Jan 2008 by jlawrence Last edited 25 Jan 2008
One thing that did come out of the talks at Harrogate is that worms will migrate to a preferred food source. So if the worms are resistant (or it has no effect) to Carbendazim - if Kate says that's the case then I'd believe her 100% - your only legal option at present is to provide an alternative food source for them.
I'd speak with both sherriff & ORM as soon as possible if I was you, also a quick phone call to Kate Entwistle won't go amiss. If she's seen them on other areas of turf then she'll know what control measures they used.
ADDED:
we're not talking tiny distances either. 100m+ was seen at one site.
Of course there's no bounce, bend your back and put some bloody effort in.
25 Jan 2008 by vid
Ebony, not bored at all , the subject is very interesting, just covered many times over recently - I know thats not your fault, but most of the information on this site several times in last couple of months
25 Jan 2008 by Steve63
I think the newer species does put a different slant on things, at least we wont depart onto the can we cant we Carbendazim route 
JL was there any mention of what would be a more palatable food source for microscolex phosphoreus?
The indication is that if we could offer cordon bleu food instead of grass and chips the worms might slither off for pastures new, maybe similar to beer traps for slugs.
Regards
Steve
Don't talk to me about Contractors Wonka, I am one myself......
25 Jan 2008 by jlawrence
They didn't talk specifically on food sources nor about the microscolex phosphoreus. Wether providing alternative food sources is a viable solution I've no idea, but it might be something worth looking into.
Of course there's no bounce, bend your back and put some bloody effort in.
25 Jan 2008 by Mal
Perhapes they may have been refeering to keeping the OM down and ensuring you have a clean sward?
Geography is everywhere
25 Jan 2008 by jlawrence
IIRC, it was an area with very low OM - ie next to nil food for the worms - and the worms migrated 100m to a more suitable area for feeding.
Of course there's no bounce, bend your back and put some bloody effort in.
25 Jan 2008 by vid
ok, ok I'm interested now, please forgive me ebony - I fall at your feet.
Could this sudden rush of small casts be a new generation growing on from eggs layed in burrows. Was there any sign of kill, did the casts go for a while then come back smaller but more numerous. There is no question that carbendazim is toxic to some worms, I would be very interested if there is a resistant species or perhaps a surface casting worm that does not feed on the surface - hence the lack of kill. Jon youve got the phone numbers I wait with baited breath - no honestly.
25 Jan 2008 by britboy
hi vid,i forgive you!The casts all seem to have erupted in last few days,a bit like the period when flying ants all appear at once in the summer.Honestly they are everywhere ,look a bit like small ant burrows as the soil is fine,dusty and about 10 mm high.I appealed for help identifying them last year but nobody could help until kate entwhistles site showed an exact match(they are bloody hard to catch and if you do get one they seem to dissolve in a jar)I think they do feed on surface due to casts but never ever see them crawling on the surface. You could be right about eggs tho as this mass problem seems to happen twice a year.I have used carbendazim but does not seem to have much effect although they do seem to go but weeks later,so i dont know if chemical has a delayed effect on them.
britboy
25 Jan 2008 by dave r-b Last edited 25 Jan 2008
Ebony,
ive just found this artical on your worms.
GLOWING WORMS.
Peter Williams (via email)
In issue 8 of Worcestershire Record there was a piece by John Meiklejohn about small worms Microscolex phosphoreus which glow in the dark when disturbed. They were found in a compost heap in Pershore. I know it's not Worcestershire but you might be interested to know that we now have them in Gloucestershire. I am the greenkeeper at Wotton-under-Edge Bowls club and we have been troubled by thousands of very small worm casts on the green that appear every night. These wouldn't be a problem (or even be noticed) in long grass but they are a real nuisance on a bowling green.
I sent photographs to Dr T Piearce at Lancaster University who suggested that they might be M. phosphoreus so we went back to the green late at night and, sure enough, the little blighters really do glow when you annoy them!.
im now an ex groundsman but hey old habits die hard
25 Jan 2008 by tonybolton
Has JL swallowed AA at Harrogate or do I need a better dictionary
A Freudian slip is when you say one thing but mean your mother
25 Jan 2008 by britboy
hi dave r-b,thats them alright but what are we going to do about them ?.As you know its a major prob on bowling greens,cant mow properly ,grass getting killed by smearing etc. i am sure you will agree it is a sight to see all these casts and it sounds like they are spreading fast!
britboy
26 Jan 2008 by jlawrence
Tony - nah, I just cut and paste the name of the worm from the first post. I'm sure it's got a more common name - but with it being from South America I probably wouldn't be able to pronounce that one either.
And don't go spreading rumours about swallowing AA - I was drunk but I don't think quite that drunk
ebony, I think at the end of the day you're likely going to need to speak with someone who has had these worms and find out what they did to control them.
Of course there's no bounce, bend your back and put some bloody effort in.
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